Nightflight
Unlocking A Better Version Of You
An archival Nightflight interview with Brendan D. Murphy on unlocking human potential and a better version of yourself.
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[0:00] Welcome and Introduction
Judith: Don't push the red button.
Welcome back to Nightflight, everybody. This is Judith Kwoba and I'm here with Brendan D. Murphy. His website is www.brandanddienmurphy.com. He is the author of the book The Grand Illusion and according to his own words, he is slightly obsessed with unlocking human potential. I wonder how that happened.
So, Brendan, welcome to Nightflight.
Brendan: Thank you, Judith. It's a pleasure to talk to you.
[0:34] A Mystical Experience and The Holographic Universe
Judith: So, yes, how did that happen? How did you become interested in the field of unlocking human potential?
Brendan: Well, I think it goes, I can trace it back to a mystical experience which really gave me a direct insight into what we fundamentally are, like what a human being actually is.
That happened not long after I read a book, which you've probably read yourself, by Michael Talbot called The Holographic Universe. And that's been around for a while. As you probably know, it's been since 1991 or 92 when it was published. So I read that when I was about 20, 19 going on 20, and it just blew my mind completely. It just destroyed all my ideas about what reality was and what's possible.
And then when I had that first sort of so-called mystical experience, I understood on an experiential level the basic truth of the essence of that message of his book. So, yeah, ever since that point, it was just solidified. It's like, well, we're infinite. So why are we living as if we're not? Why are we living these small little lives? Why are we allowing ourselves to be manipulated and controlled? And why would we not want to experience the fullness of that potential that's implied by infinity?
So I kind of just ran with it from there. I've never looked back.
[2:02] Why We Quit Self-Development
Judith: Yeah. So, I think we are at a junction now where it is really not a good idea to give up on our human potential and our self-development. And that is why I invited you because you wrote an article about why we always quit when it comes to self-development. I would like to start there and let's talk a little bit about those stages that we psychologically go through.
Brendan: Yeah, sure. All right, cool. So what you'll find what happens when people try to branch out into something new is that initially, if you can inspire people, they'll start off with a level, a certain level of enthusiasm and excitement. If you can get people excited, then they'll sign up for just about anything, right?
And that stage, see, what we're talking about, Judith, for your audience is the emotional cycle of change, which was a model outlined in the 70s by Kelly and Connor, if my memory serves me correctly. So they were psychologists and they outlined this process that humans go through when they try to change something in their lives, starting with their self internally.
So the first stage is uninformed optimism. You don't really know exactly what you're signing up for, but you're pretty keen, you're pretty enthused, you're pretty excited, and you just want to get in there and start smashing it. And this is obviously the romanticised phase where we see everything through rose-coloured lenses and we're expecting the best and we're hoping for the best and maybe we underestimate the amount of work that might be involved in front of us and we don't really quite know what we're in for.
And then what happens is that we, as time goes on, we're trying to create a change. We're trying to create this change. We're trying to make it sustainable. We start realising that it's a little bit harder than we originally. So, basically, I've got to do this, I've got to do this, and I've got to do this, and there's these steps, and this process, and I'm feeling a bit uncomfortable here, and I'm out of my comfort zone. And that's the stage that they called informed pessimism.
So that's where we start to actually become aware of what the hell we've signed up for, and what it's going to involve. So basically, in other words, the discomfort starts to actually become a reality and the personal cost of trying to change this thing is starting to now show up and become evident. So we're starting to get a bit uncomfortable.
[5:00] The Chemistry of Habit
Brendan: So it's really interesting. Joe Dispenza has talked and written about this a lot. And we've got this, we all have our own day-to-day kind of state of being, our thought patterns, our habits that we just run on autopilot. And as soon as we try to change that, it causes an upset in the chemical sort of balance of our bodies because the cells of your body are fed every day by a cocktail of neurotransmitters and your brain is just constantly pumping out these chemical messengers and your cells receive them and take them on board and they adapt to that and they get used to that.
Judith: Yes, yes. I hate to interrupt my guests. I just wanted to sing. Let's go back to the first phase. Would you say that, let's say, New Year's resolutions fall into that category where we might do well the first couple of days and then...
Brendan: Yeah, because we have great intentions, right? We can execute those intentions for about two days before it all kind of falls flat on its face and we realise that we're not really in our comfort zone anymore.
Judith: Yeah, okay. But the enthusiasm, I guess if you can keep that throughout the process, that's a very good aspect. But as you said, when let's say the painful things start to arise, let's say you, oh, I give up smoking. Oh, you are going to have fun.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, you really are. You really are. It's a lot of fun breaking an addiction and a habit.
[unclear]: Excuse me.
Brendan: Yeah, so that's it. As a smoker, your body is experiencing and taking in this chemical cocktail every day. And your brain and your body gets used to that. And then it craves that. It wants that. It's normal. It's baseline functioning is that chemical sort of state. So as soon as you stop that and interrupt the flow of the cigarette chemicals into your body, your cells start freaking out and they're going, what are you doing? You've upset the balance. I'm really not happy with this.
And basically, it's like that with everyday habits, like non-toxic habits, things that we just do on autopilot. It's like that same process is going on. You try to break a habit, any habit you can think of that's really entrenched in your functioning day to day, and it is like trying to quit smoking.
Judith: It is, yeah. Or let's say you really want to cut down drastically or even eliminate sugar intake. And then you have this, I want sugar, I want sugar. And the parasites and whatever is connected to that, that are, they are all happily living in your intestines. I want sugar.
Brendan: Yeah, that's so right. That's so true. That's so true. Because there's a conflict, like the part of you that decides, I'm going to stop having sugar, is this part. It's the prefrontal lobe of the brain. That's the most highly evolved part of the brain. And then that is now trying to override every other part of the body, which is telling you, give me the sugar. Come on, bring it back. Bring back the sugar. And you've got this one. This guy here is running the show where he's supposed to be if we live intentionally.
That's where you need to have some understanding of basic human psychology and what you're going to go through in advance so that you're prepared and maybe have some strategies to go with it so that you can get through the difficult patches as they arrive, because they're going to show up and it's going to get difficult for sure.
Judith: And this neurotransmitter cocktail that you talk about, I think that is important that people comprehend that, that there is a chemical process, a biochemical process going on that is trying to stop me. And it's good to know that in advance and not to just blindly run into that. It's a little bit uncomfortable.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah. Like, then you can go into battle like a warrior, be prepared, you understand, I'm going up against every cell in my body here. And if I fail, it's not going to be the fault of the world or the people I live with. It's going to be me succumbing to the addiction that my cells have to the way that I was yesterday, to my state of being that I was habituated to yesterday.
And that's what's so hard, is that every single thought that you think creates a chemical response in the brain. Your brain, from the limbic system, it sends out neurotransmitters. And so you can imagine how many thoughts you have throughout the course of a normal day. You're just constantly feeding these chemicals into your body.
So over time, if you're not one of these people, even someone like Tony Robbins, who's all about personal transformation and all about change and just constantly growing, growing, growing. Someone like that still has habits that they do day to day. They still have their habits. And if they were to try and break them or formulate new ones, even they would go through a difficult time in doing it because they have become habituated to a certain way of doing things and they have their own chemical cocktail going on and they've got to override that in order to create the next version of themselves.
So we're all kind of in the same boat on that. It's a question of where are we living from and how are we approaching this? Is it coming from intentionality in the frontal lobe of the brain or is it coming from all the addicts in our body, all the cells that just don't want to change?
Judith: Yeah, yeah. So if you go to battle, don't be surprised if the other side shoots back. They're ready. They're waiting and they're heavily armed.
Brendan: Yes, they certainly are.
[11:33] The Valley of Despair
Judith: So, step number three.
Brendan: We're about, yeah, so we're kind of approaching number three here. This is basically where you're like, okay, now you've gone past feeling a little bit uncomfortable and now you're like, oh, God, this sucks. I'm out.
Judith: The valley of despair.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, the valley of despair. That's it. So, man, that's where you really need some strategy and basic self-awareness and it really helps to know this stuff. Having a mentor, something like that, like having an external influence on you who's on board with your agenda and wants to help you get there, like an accountability partner or something where you're checking in and you're not just relying on your own little, your own brain, which is trying to sabotage you anyway. So it's really helpful to have some input from other people who want you to succeed.
And that stage three is where most people actually fall off the wagon and quit because it's just so hard and so difficult and they're so far out of their comfort zone now that they can't see far enough ahead into a positive outcome. They can't envision success anymore. They can't see it working out. And the payoffs are now completely outweighed by the costs. So the costs are really heavy now. They're really uncomfortable. All their addict cells are going mental at them. And the benefits are just non-existent. So this is where most people quit something new. And it depends what it is as to how quickly they get into that stage three, but that's where you lose most people.
Like most entrepreneurs, for example, like some of the people I've worked with over the last couple of years, you can see the psychology playing out in front of your eyes, and it's just like you can only help people so much. At the end of the day, their willingness to push through the discomfort and sustain it over a period of time, however long it takes. Like you have to have that almost psychotic mentality of I'm going to make this work no matter what. I don't care what happens. This will work. In the end, I will make it work.
And people who don't have that mentality, they're the ones who fall apart and they go back into their comfort zone because you've got this rubber band around you and you're trying to go over here in a new direction and your comfort zone is back here and the rubber band is just pulling you back into the comfort zone and you're trying to get out here.
And that's what happens. You have to have that sustained willpower and that warrior mentality, because you know you're going into battle and you're going to go through the valley of despair. You're going to walk through the valley of the shadow of death. You're going to go through the darkness.
And if you don't realize that this is just a natural part of human psychology and the process of change, then it's going to hit you kind of unawares. What happens with a lot of people is they feel like something abnormal is happening, or there's something wrong with them, or they're a failure or whatever, and they'll build a story out of it. But it's just normal. It's just normal. You just need to know that this is what's coming when you try to do something new and worthwhile.
In my observation and experience, most of what's worth doing in life is challenging. It's not easy. All the things that are really worth doing and that really give us fulfillment and a huge payoff and satisfaction take effort and sustained effort. And usually we have to go in a new direction and outside the comfort zone, and we have to fight that rubber band which is pulling us back, that personal ecology.
[15:02] Unconscious Family Allegiances
Brendan: And there's so much going on in a human being and the human psyche. We've got these unconscious allegiances to family, to ancestry, to mum and to dad and to grandpa and grandma. And we don't even know it. It's all happening on an unconscious level. And we form these beliefs or associations when we're infants. And we go, oh, mum, you've got this problem. Because I love you so much, I'll take that problem from you. I'll take it on and I'll create it for myself, thinking that we'll take it off them and unburden them. But what we end up doing is duplicating the problem. So now there's two people with it. And obviously you can't help people like that, right?
But in our naivety and our good intentions, we try to do these things as babies and children. We have these really noble goals and aspirations because we love our family and whatever. So from a very young age, we've got these very strong, emotionally driven allegiances. And that also is a huge part of the rubber band that holds us back in our comfort zone, because it's like, well, mum and dad, they were broke. So as a sign of loyalty to them, I'm going to stay broke too. That's happening on a subconscious nonverbal level for people and they have no idea what they're actually up against.
So it's not about blaming people when they don't succeed. If we could just understand that all the different layers of what we're actually tackling in the psyche, it would make it a lot more doable.
Judith: Yeah. That reminds me of somebody that I knew. He was brought up in a house where the stance always was, we are not that kind of people with business success. We are just not that kind of people. And he tried to be self-employed. Always [unclear]. Always. Like clockwork. No matter what it was, no matter what he touched. And that was years ago. And even then I thought, yeah, I'm not surprised, because with that attitude that they raised you. That is probably the tape that you have still running.
[17:27] Beliefs, Identity and Belonging
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And how many people have that going on in their families, all these beliefs, and that goes into your core identity. That becomes who you are, who you think you are. I am not a businessman. I am not going to be part of a successful enterprise, venture, whatever, because my mum and dad weren't and our family's just not that way. That's not something we do. So I can't be part of something like that because that's not who I am. And that's all really deeply, deeply embedded. That's gut-level identity stuff.
And that's a part of this whole dynamic of unconscious allegiance as well. We don't want to break out of, because we need to belong. Humans need to belong so badly. And we don't want to break out of the family. We don't want to be disowned. We don't want mum and dad to stop loving us. We have all these subconscious kinds of fears and programs playing out in the background. And that's all part of the decision-making. That actually informs our decision-making process. We're not really deciding a whole lot of stuff at a conscious level. It's really all subconsciously decided for us. And so if we have allowed all those programs and beliefs to just run rampant in the background, we have a lot to fight against if we want to change our lives.
[18:49] Trading Time for Money
Brendan: I've come from a family where it's sort of like most of us have come from a family where you trade your time for money. You work for a year on a salary and you'll get paid X amount of dollars and you're only getting paid for when you're at work kind of thing. Or you've got to show up in X certain number of days. And it's like we now live in a world where that doesn't need to be the case. But that's the conditioning we have, to go and trade your time for money, $30 an hour or $100 an hour or whatever. But now because of technology, we can actually set up streams of revenue, multiple streams of revenue that come in while we're sleeping.
But most of us psychologically aren't ready to do that because we've got all this programming and beliefs about who we are and what we should or shouldn't, what we're entitled to, what we're worthy of, what we deserve. People get hurt when they're really young and they form a belief like, I'm not lovable. Because they got treated badly by a parent, they may go around into their lives thinking that they're unlovable, unworthy of love.
And it's like, we've got to tackle all these different layers of self or false self, false selfhood, and pull it all apart and replace it with something that serves us and is limitless, really, because we're adaptable and we need to capitalise and exploit that, right? You and me are adaptable. We can change all our beliefs. We can change a massive amount of who we think we are. We still have our core personality elements that won't really ever change a lot, but we can get rid of all the stories that we've built up around it. And that's all very malleable. But the first step is realising it's there.
Judith: Yeah, that's so wonderful that you said that, because I always tell people, ask yourself, who would I be without my story?
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, that's a really good question. If you strip that away.
Judith: So what is left? And then we come to the core.
[20:53] Online Work and the Old Paradigm
Judith: But what you just said, the technology that we have, and even then, let's say you go for it, because I sometimes observe that, you know who Vinnie Eastwood is, yeah?
Brendan: Yeah.
Judith: Yeah. So, and he gets it a lot in the comment section, people telling him, get a real job.
Brendan: Yeah.
Judith: And when I read comments like that, it's, well said, good slave, get a real job. But at the same time, those people have no problem with the fact that, let's say, a news anchor has a weekly show at, what do I know, CNN, whatever. They get paid thousands and thousands of dollars. They have no problem with that. That's a real job. But if you do it, let's say like Vinnie does it or like we are, no, no, no, no, you're just chatting. That's not a job.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah. Information's information, right? But apparently it only counts if you're doing it on the six o'clock news. That's that paradigm. That paradigm is the paradigm that's now behind us. And all of those news stations and TV stations, they're all dying out now. They're all dinosaurs.
And what we do is we traffic in information. We deal with information and essentially, as an author, when I sell a book, I'm selling information, really. I'm selling a massive amount of research and investigation and perspective that I've built up over years. If you are a bit more informed, that kind of effort is much more valuable than what the guy on the news does, because he is just reading a script that someone else wrote for him. And it doesn't serve our agenda. It serves the agenda of a very, very small, very powerful group of people.
So it's just imprinting. Whoever says go get a real job, they've imprinted on the old paradigm, which is before the internet really even existed. They don't have the concept of being able to work online. They don't understand that concept. That's what we do. I work with people online. I write my books and I can sell them online. All this entrepreneurial stuff happens online. But in the world of someone who was born before 1950, for most people, it's completely incomprehensible. They have a completely different world model.
Now information is really the currency that we're moving into more than it used to be. It used to be about money and physical items and goods, but we're moving into information as the currency now, and that's just a radical paradigm shift.
[24:04] Censorship and Misinformation
Judith: Yeah. And they are fighting back already. Did you see the Avaaz article?
Brendan: Ah, tell me.
Judith: You know Avaaz, Soros, NGO, yeah? And just as a side note, please don't sign petitions there. Yeah, it's not for the betterment of humanity. So anyway, they have an article that said, why is YouTube allowing misinformation about climate change? So, very long thing. And long story short, they are pressuring YouTube to demonetize channels that are not going along with the official climate change story. These channels, they should not be searchable, those videos, or best would be to delete them altogether. And Elizabeth Warren, senator from the U.S., she even suggested recently that people should be put in jail for spreading misinformation like that. That is where we are. That is how frightened they are of information flow that is coming from all directions and that is not going along with their side of the story.
Brendan: Oh, massively, massively. Judith, give me one second. I'm just going to shut this window here because I've got a lot of noise coming through. I'll be back in one second.
Okay, so yeah.
Judith: Yeah, they have their diapers full.
Brendan: Oh yeah.
Judith: That is why I look at it.
Brendan: They're terrified. They're so, so scared of people waking up and asking questions that it's just, it's so obvious. You're not allowed to question anything about the religion of climate change and global warming. You're not allowed to ask questions about any medical interventions. And in Australia, I think they recently passed some kind of legislation where if a medical practitioner, like a nurse, was to question vaccination or to encourage more critical thinking in their patients, then they would be criminally prosecuted.
So it's pretty out of control. When you have that level of mind control and thought control and censorship, that is a hallmark of a fascist dictatorship, that should tell people something's radically wrong.
Judith: Yeah, yeah. The way it is going, it seems to me we are back to the Middle Ages in terms of free thinking.
Brendan: Yeah.
Judith: If you said something outrageous there, you will be burned at the stake.
Brendan: Burn the witch.
Judith: Burn the witch.
Brendan: Yeah.
Judith: They do not really burn you, but yeah, they can either ruin your career or, yeah.
Brendan: Yeah, no, they just burn your career instead and burn your reputation. And that's how they do it. Career assassination, career and character assassination.
Judith: Yeah.
Brendan: Yeah. So I'm sure that they would kill people if they could get away with it. But, yeah, it's not allowed.
Judith: Not yet.
Brendan: No, no. Yeah, so.
Judith: We will see if they get more desperate.
Brendan: Yeah, I think they'll get more desperate, definitely. Everywhere we look, in the US and Australia, they're pushing this hardline sort of approach on these things, and it's, oh man, but they're being defeated at the same time. They're losing a lot of battles as well, which is fantastic. It's a sign of the times, Judith, I think we've got a lot of indications that we're leaving the dark ages now. And we're transitioning slowly into something a little lighter.
And yeah, it's a little bit sad, but as I always say, look at it this way. It shows their desperation and it also shows there is something going on that they don't like. Otherwise, they wouldn't go to such length to suppress information.
Oh man, it's just crazy. It's really everywhere you look, you find someone like George Soros or one of these other cronies of the cabal. It's a shame now that we can't get more people to look into this stuff and willingly go there.
[29:25] Creating Instead of Reacting
Brendan: It's sort of like there's been a bifurcation of the populace, and we've got people like us who are still the minority who have made their choice and we're going that way, and the majority who have made their choice and they're going that way. I don't think we're ever going to get the twain to meet.
I think for a long time, our minority is going to keep growing, but the people who have committed to that hard line, no, no, no, no, no, no, everything the authorities tell us is 100% reliable, no, no, no, go away conspiracy theorists, they're never going to change, we're never going to get them on board. So I've really stopped trying.
I think there was a real, I went through a long period of time where I spent maybe four, five years quite solidly pulling apart the mainstream false reality, all the stuff they kept shoving down our throats. And I just feel like now is the time where instead of pointing out continuously, day in, day out, everything that's wrong and all the stupid crap that they try to get us to believe, it's more useful now to start creating what we want to create.
What kind of life do you want to have up here? What kind of experience do you want to have here on this planet? Do you want to keep letting these losers run the show? These psychopaths with too much time on their hands? Or do you want to actually go out and create the kind of world that you want to live in and you would be proud to leave? Subsequent generations.
Let's be creative, because I feel like that's where the momentum is now, instead of being reactive and going, oh, there's another conspiracy over there and they're trying to poison us in this way and now they're trying to poison us. Now they're chemtrailing and it's never going to stop. It's not going to stop anytime soon anyway. So let's create the solutions instead of being constantly distracted by, now it's coronavirus and everyone's talking about coronavirus. That's the whole news feed on Facebook is coronavirus. That's like, it's great to be aware, but there's also a point where it's like it's a distraction.
Yes, of course. So we need a little bit of synergy, let's be creative and bring ourselves out of the dark ages and create the kind of era that we want to have.
[31:33] The Emotional Cycle of Change
Brendan: And speaking of coming out of the darkness, phase four of the emotional cycle of change was informed optimism. So that's the point where if you push through the third dark, the stage of darkness, the valley of despair. It's because now you're starting to get some results and you're starting to feel good about it. And the habits, you've actually formed some new habits, probably your behaviour and thinking has actually changed on a fundamental kind of a level. And now you can actually go, oh, this is not so bad. Let's keep going. I think my chances here are actually looking a little better.
And then you can move into stage five, which is success. That's where you've got the fulfilment and you can reap what you've sown. That's where the cumulative benefits of all the hard work and picking apart all the conspiracies and all the lies and all the frauds is now realised in a level of achievement and freedom that you didn't have before and a new state of being, the new human, because you have to be a new version of you to be able to move into the new reality, right? The old version of you had to occupy that old reality because he created the old reality and you wanted this new reality over here. So that has to be occupied by a new version of you. And the only way you get there is by changing you on those fundamental levels. That's how you get from A to B. And that's why it's so uncomfortable. And that's why so few people make it.
But if we can be aware of ourselves in the process and not be so hard on ourselves and be aware of all the levels and layers that are playing out in the background, we put ourselves in a better position in general, as individuals and collectively as well, in the planetary challenge or journey, the hero's journey that we're all on, trying to establish a level of freedom and a world that's not run by psychopaths. That's kind of the same kind of journey that we're on.
[33:29] People Who Don't Get It and NPCs
Judith: Yeah. You already mentioned it, that there will always be people who don't get it.
Brendan: Yeah.
Judith: And sometimes, let's say you really outline it from A to Z, you have no logic fallacies in it and you really explain it well, and then you get, I don't know, a dead glance or a reaction. That doesn't make sense. You come to a point where you think there's nobody at home.
Brendan: Nobody at home.
Judith: So what do you make of the idea that we have NPCs here?
Brendan: That we have what, sorry?
Judith: NPCs, non-player characters.
Brendan: Ah, yeah, that's been floating around recently. Man, well, how are you defining an NPC?
Judith: Somebody that is totally immersed with the matrix and no matter what you tell them, no matter what you can even prove, will make a difference. It's like a program that is running.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Judith: And there is no way out of that program.
Brendan: No, there's no way out at the level of program functioning. No. I mean, if your way of dealing with everything is through the programming, then you're going to stay stuck in the programming. And if you can't let another piece of information in to your system and integrate that and work with it, then you're going to, you are going to be an NPC. That's what they're, they're basically zombies. And I don't mean to, these are human beings, but they're not living consciously. They are unconscious. They are non-player, what is it, non-player characters. And they're just, they are not living their lives. The programs are living them out. The programs they've been indoctrinated with are just living them. And they're addicted to it. Their cells are addicted to it. Their brain is unconsciously addicted to it, their whole body. And truth to those people is very uncomfortable.
I can remember even as a truth seeker, if I go back about 16 years, around about 16 years, I read my first David Icke book and that was my first sort of political conspiracy type book. And I got 99 pages into that. And even though I was an open-minded, spiritually aware human, to see the level of manipulation and control on that scale laid out, page after page after page, made me sick to my stomach. And I had to put that book down for, thank you, I think a month before I came back to it. But I had that time to integrate it. And I kept going because for whatever reason, I'm just one of those people who can't, I'm not going to live in denial. I just can't do it. I can't go and live in that fantasy world and pretend that everything's okay.
But on a higher level, it kind of is. On a higher level, it's, we're spirit beings. We're going to be unharmed in the immortal essence of who we are. So we're in this sort of virtual reality video game and a lot of us, unfortunately, are NPCs. That's part of their soul journey and they'll probably be needing a few more lifetimes to catch on to the nature of the game and start waking up.
[37:12] Spirit and Soul
Judith: In your book, what is the difference between spirit and soul?
Brendan: To me, that's semantics, I think. I don't personally, yeah, I see people use soul in one way and then this guy over here says soul in a completely opposite way and this guy says this is what spirit is and it's like, to me, it really is a matter of classification. It's a classification issue and everyone has their own system for doing that, breaking it all down. I just kind of look at the different levels and layers of who and what we are. And I don't necessarily have a hard and fast definition of soul and spirit.
A human being to me is composed of many, many, many different elements, different aspects, different layers. And we are a field, we're nested energy fields. We've got a physical body, we've got an etheric body, we've got an emotional body, we've got a mental body, we've got a causal body and on and on and on it goes. So it's sort of like, where are you, how are you going to classify all this and pull it apart? To me it's, thank you, I haven't made an effort to really go, this is spirit and this is soul. Because to me, it's not really important.
[38:28] Building a Better World
Judith: Okay. So, when, I totally agree, we have to build a better world ourselves. We cannot vote in a better world. That will never function. So how do we do that? How do we build a better world?
Brendan: Oh, the question of the ages. I'm glad you're keeping it easy for me, Judith.
Judith: Yes, yes, yes. Just very surface level.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. When are we going to get to the deeper stuff?
Yeah, I think it's simple, but I don't think it's easy because the better world is dependent on us. It's contingent on a human being's choices as to how they want to function and live in the world. And then we have millions and millions of human beings who all have to make day-to-day choices of who they are and how they want to show up in the world. And if you're saying you want a better world, then you really need to make a better version of you. That's where it starts.
This is what I was getting at with pointing at all the conspiracies going, oh, here's this and there's that and now they're doing this and now they're doing that. Yeah, we know we're manipulated. We get it. Now what are you going to do to become something that outgrows this whole system of manipulation? This is how I work with people. This is what I'm doing with my work with people in groups and one-on-one with the DNA activation, the sound work. And Evolve Yourself is exactly that. I'm helping people to actually evolve into or mutate into a new version of humanity, a new version of themselves that is no longer responsive to the usual controls and manipulations. So we are outgrowing the system. That's the only way to do it. The whole revolution has to start internally.
[40:27] Awareness Versus Habitual Distraction
Judith: But some people might say you are, I know exactly what you mean. If you stay non-reactive, you are aware of certain things, let's say coronavirus, because it's so popular right now, but to a certain degree you stay non-reactive. You certainly do not go into panic mode and it is also not the only thing that you are researching. So yeah, you can spend days and weeks doing that. But if you're coming from that non-reactive state, some people might say you are, yeah, you don't care.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, it's interesting. I think there's a point where you have to get out of the part of your brain that creates the survival anxiety and the fear. And the people who can't do that are the ones who would say to me, oh, you're, well, you've changed. What are you doing? You're not into all the conspiracy stuff. It's like, no, I am. I'm aware. It's just that instead of reacting to everything like you've been programmed to do, you're programmed into being reactive and you don't even realise it.
There's a point where awareness becomes habitual distraction. And now in that habitual distraction, you can still be part of the problem because you're not actually being an effective human. You're not living your personal soul's mission and that's actually what the world needs you to do. That's your responsibility, is to live your soul's mission and do it and be aware.
But live your mission, where I see a lot of people getting stuck in that downward spiral of a billion different conspiracies and it's all very depressing and it's this downward emotional spiral and they sort of crash and they feel like everything's hopeless and they're stuck in that part of the brain, that sort of fight or flight response and it's like it's just switched on all the time and they can't get out of it and entertain the question of what do you want to create? Because if you're living from the creative space, you're living up here in the prefrontal lobe and you're actually living with intentionality.
Whereas a lot of conspiracy buffs get stuck in the trap of being perpetually distracted and emotionally drained by it and they're down, they're really sort of depressed about it. And from that place, they can't be effective. They can't think of solutions. They can't think creatively because they're living out of the lower parts of the brain that don't create those solutions, that don't have that creativity. They're reactive. Those parts of the brain, like the limbic system, the mammalian brain and the reptilian brain, they're reactive. And they are not going to provide us solutions at a higher level to the problem that we've got now. They're just, they're down here at the level of the problem going, we've got all these problems. And it's like, yeah, okay. What are you going to do about it?
And that's where it's like, okay, we have to actually evolve. We have to evolve to a level where the problems actually kind of start solving themselves, and you start seeing them in a whole new light, and you realise, oh, instead of being reactive, I'll respond. I will respond intentionally. I will respond to what needs my energy. If it doesn't need my energy and input, I'm not touching it, because I've got a frigging mission. I'm on a mission. I'm here to change the world. I'm here to help millions of people. And I'm not going to let all these endless, endless distractions continue to pull me off course. So it's a very different headspace to operate in.
[44:02] A New Bone Every Day
Judith: Yeah, and you get another bone every other day. When I look at January of this year, first it was hashtag World War III, the Iran situation, yeah. So then that boiled down a little bit, then coronavirus. Now you can start panicking. Then this stupid, stupid so-called peace plan for the Middle East. Yeah, okay. And now Japan is set to release 1.2 million tons of radioactive water into the ocean. So they throw you a bone every other day and you can wear yourself out. You know what I mean?
Brendan: Yeah. There is no end to this.
Judith: No. You know about it, you rant about it, but there's no solution.
Brendan: That's right. And if you can't personally be a part of a creative solution to something, then for pragmatic purposes, you may as well just get on with living your life and do something useful. Because if you can't be part of a solution for one of these big problems that they're throwing at us, constantly throwing us these bones, it's like, take your attention off it, because you're not solving anything. You're feeding energy into it and achieving nothing. So go do something useful with yourself. What is your mission? What are you contributing to the world from your soul, from your heart? What are you giving that's going to help override all this crap that they keep throwing at us and help everybody grow beyond it into a whole new paradigm and way of being on the planet? That's our challenge.
[45:58] Fear, Immunity and Energy Harvesting
Judith: Yeah. Would you think that those people who are coming more from that point of view, that, okay, I know about it, I do not react, have a better chance, let's say, to overcome the coronavirus, to survive? I mean, we will see. I said it can go either way. Maybe in two weeks we will no longer talk about it. Or, yeah, they are trying to get rid of a huge chunk of the population, which is also possible. At this stage, a lot of things are possible. So, do you think that that attitude is more helpful?
Brendan: Being in fear is just never helpful. It's going to undermine your immune system. It puts you into stress, puts you into fight or flight. On a health level, there's no good that can come from that. Some people might get infected by coronavirus. I think from what I've seen, the number is relatively small in the grand scheme of things. If you've got a healthy immune system, if you're looking after yourself, why would you be worried about it? You shouldn't be any more worried about that than the yearly annual flu. How often do you get the annual flu? Why worry about it if you're looking after yourself? Put your attention into something constructive instead of something that puts you into fear. That's only going to drag you into that reality. That reality is they're trying to drag us down into fear. And that's what half of this is. It's like an energy harvest. They put our attention onto something, and in the act of looking at it, this is an occult reality. I've got this in my book as well, in one of the chapters, I get right into this. As soon as you look at something, you feed energy into it. That's a fact. As soon as you pay any attention to anything, any system, you pump information and energy into it. So they're playing a game, and their game is manipulation and control and harvesting of energy, like soul harvesting. So why would you step into that game? It's not your game. Why would you play it?
[48:18] The 5D Fad
Judith: Yeah. Some people, especially in the new age, there seems to be this thought that, oh, once we go to 5D, everything will be hanky-dory. And as if it's the be-all, end-all. And personally, I would say, how do you know that that is not corrupted as well? Where does that come from? Everything's going to be fine once we go to 5D. What are your thoughts?
Brendan: Yeah, I think there's a certain kind of personality type that really gets into that 5D kind of thinking and paradigm, and it becomes almost like a badge of honour, a status prop in our community. People start using a certain language and they start using buzzwords like 5D, and they start because they think that it gives them prestige and status and it makes them seem like they know something most people don't know. And that's again, that's the status thing. I just think it's very ungrounded and quite often very flaky. It's a very conceptual thing. What is this? I'm extremely well versed in this kind of new age and metaphysical and occult stuff, and I just don't think that a lot of these people are that well studied in it. And it's very ungrounded. How about we deal with third density where we live as physical beings, as spiritual beings in physical bodies, inhabiting these bodies. Let's use them effectively in 3D and see what we can do instead of going off into these conceptual realms of imagination and imaginative thinking. Going, oh yeah, like you said, it'll all be hunky-dory when we can all transition into 5D. How is your five dimensions going to be tackling these issues creatively in a grounded, nuts and bolts kind of way? I get the whole intention thing and being intentional and putting energy into things, and that level of thinking, but I think it's a bit of a fad and a bit of a little bit of a statusy kind of thing. Very ungrounded for the most part anyway. Why do we need to keep talking about 5D? And what happened to 4D? What's so wrong with 4D? There's a transition. There's a transition there as well. There's something, we're just skip 4, we're going straight to 5. That's where the golden meadow is. Everything's going to be beautiful. Let's just go straight to five.
[51:09] Being in the Body Before Leaving It
Judith: Yeah. And another thing, a lot of people have this, and I'm not saying you are bad people or there's something very wrong with it, but people trying to get out of their bodies, having out-of-body experiences. But sometimes I think, you know what, guys? Maybe we should learn to be in our body first. Not always here. Be in your body, experience that. And maybe if you are grounded in that, maybe then it's time to do an out-of-body experience. But I see that as more problematic, that people are always in this. Do you know what I mean?
Brendan: I think we're very dissociated.
Judith: I agree.
Brendan: And collectively, we're very traumatised. And the more traumatised people are, the more they get out of their body. It's a defence mechanism, right? It's a protective mechanism. So the more traumatised and messed up we are, the more outside of ourselves we are, and the more we're going to be living out up here, and up in our heads and in our intellect, and really not present in our bodies. And I know from experience how that works and how that plays out because I've done it myself. And our challenge is not to ascend. It's not to ascend to 5D. It's incension. We need to incend into our bodies because that's the only place that we can resolve the trauma. That's the only place that we can deal with what's built up in ourselves, all that cellular trauma and damage and all that energy that is waiting to be transformed and released. That's where we have to deal with it, in the body. And there's a lot of head-tripping stuff out there. People want you to go meditate and sit in full lotus position and leave the world, get away from it all, escape from it all. And there's a lot of escapism that's dressed up as spiritual progress and being evolved, when what people are unconsciously doing is escaping from their unresolved issues. And so for me, it's all about coming back into the body, because that's where a spiritual person then becomes effective in the world. And the world needs us to be effective because we've made a friggin' mess of it.
[53:42] Meditation, Lotus Position and Living Intentionally
Judith: Yeah, it's not about sitting in lotus position and say om every 30 minutes.
Brendan: No, no. And what are we supposed to do if we have tight hips and we can't sit cross-legged like that for more than two minutes? Are we not spiritual? It's like, if we could get away from the doctrinaire thinking and the dogmatic kind of attitude and just be a little bit more fluid and adaptive. To be honest, I'm not even remotely drawn to meditation at the moment. I haven't been for quite a long time and I don't do anything that... You're the same.
Judith: Yeah.
Brendan: Wow. See? I think there's something in that. For me, my life is lived intentionally. What I do is intentional. My actions on a day-to-day basis are designed to make the world a better place and to make me a better human so that I'm better at making the world a better place. So the more time I sit in lotus position, being the galaxy and being infinity, that's not really, I've been there and done that and I've got the t-shirt. I don't need to keep doing that. I know the foundation. So for me, it's about creating from an embodied, grounded perspective as a spiritual being. I think you're onto that.
Judith: Yeah, what I will do is I live in a sanctuary. And when I go out and I take walks, I do that, yeah, some people call it a walking meditation. It's just that I'm here. I'm here in this moment now. As much as possible, mentally, I will not run two days into the future or five years back or whatever. I'm just walking. I'm paying attention to what is going on around me. I honour the bushes, the trees, the birds, whatever. You know what I mean. That I will do. But sitting there in my room, no.
Brendan: Yeah, I think that the momentum is with people like us. The momentum is, the energy now on the planet is to create change, and it's an outward expansion, from the inside out. That's why it's so crucial that we are in our bodies and that we've dealt with our shit and got our stuff resolved and healed and all that, because the energy is to create from the internal outwards now and create a world based on the values that we have, rather than the values that the 0.0001% have, which are completely, complete opposites. But they're helping us to realise, through their psychopathy, they're helping us to realise and to grow, really. Our challenge is to grow from within out and create from that place. And I think sitting in a darkened room, getting all galactic and cosmic, there was a time for that for me. And that was when I was in my early 20s. And that was a long time ago. So now it's about doing. It's about action.
Judith: Yeah.
There is a line of thought that if one person changes their attitude, it's a ripple effect. You know what I mean?
If something changes for the collective, even if the collective doesn't notice it, would you say there's something to that?
Brendan: Yeah, I definitely would. I wrote about that. I made a point of drawing attention to that in my book, which is The Grand Illusion, for your listeners. And there's been a few studies done that have really supported that idea.
Rupert Sheldrake wrote about it in his book where he talked about formative causation and morphogenetic fields and this idea of accumulated momentum in the collective psyche or collective energy field of the planet. And it's like you said, it only takes one person to do an action, or a certain number of people to do an action, and then all of a sudden a critical threshold point gets reached and, boom, it becomes available to a whole host of people without any effort, without any intention.
There's a story about the hundredth monkey, the monkey that went and washed his sand off the rice. And that's been debated as, it may not be entirely accurate, that's what happened. But these other monkeys suddenly, on other islands that were totally unconnected, started doing this behaviour as well and nobody had ever seen it before. And it turns out that it's true.
We've got experiments that show rats run a maze faster in subsequent generations than they, or maybe not even related rats, but other rats, because they're part of the same collective gene pool and part of the same morphic field. So as soon as they reach a critical threshold of running the maze successfully and getting to the end, that information is stored in the collective field. And it becomes available to all of the rats. And suddenly all of the rats start showing improvements in getting to the end of the maze. They get to the cheese quicker because the information is there.
Whereas the first generation didn't have that knowledge. They didn't have the information. They had to learn the hard way. But two or three generations down the line, it's part of their collective morphic field. And they don't need to learn through so much trial and error. They can just go. Get the cheese straight away. And that's playing out on a collective scale for all of us as well.
[59:37] Science and the Occult
Judith: I know one subject that you also go into is science and the occult. So what is the connection then?
Brendan: Oh, I think a lot. Yeah, I think a lot. There's a lot of connections. If you look at what occultists have been doing, particularly some of the theosophists that I point to, essentially they've extended science. They've extended the scientific method and they've extended the realm of scientific pursuit and investigation.
And so ultimately now we've reached, in the 21st century, a point where we've got all this technology that can start showing us visually what seers and psychics have been able to see for millennia. And now we can start to see it as well through technology, which we know doesn't have visual hallucinations and it doesn't have fantasies. It's showing us something there energetically as one example. So we can investigate a lot of occult ideas now in ways that we couldn't before because of the development and progress of technology.
So we can see the human auric field. We can see the etheric aspect of the auric field in Kirlian photography, for example. And then other people like Harry Oldfield came along and they developed it and took it further. And now we can see, to a certain extent, maybe thought forms. We can see if someone imagines a ball of light above their head. And I mentioned this in the book. This is an experiment I talked about where they thought about internally. They didn't say anything about it, but they thought about a ball of light. And then suddenly a beam of light showed up, a column of light manifested.
And they've done experiments in telepathy where people have mentally sent an image of a shape, like a triangle, to a recipient whose energy field is being scanned by the Kirlian device, and in the field around their finger, or thumb, that shape has actually shown up and manifested in a completely bizarre and abnormal way that you would never in a million years expect under normal conditions, but you can transmit this information. So we have technology to now show us the effects of our thoughts on each other. We can prove that we can transmit information and send messages to each other.
And I think chapter six, I got into Leadbeater and Besant's investigation into subatomic particles and quarks. And that was, to me, one of the most interesting things that I've seen in the realm of the occult because they essentially psychically were able to witness and actually draw in high detail subatomic particles called quarks, which hadn't even been discovered yet. I don't even think they'd been postulated at that point in time. And so it's just fascinating to see that we've got the ability now to reconcile a lot of this sort of obscure, weird, esoteric stuff. And we can say, oh, no, well, actually, 21st century physics or 20th century physics is actually starting to verify this.
And we've got this electronic device that can show you that. There's this serpent-like being that's wrapped itself around you and is causing certain symptoms. And I did talk about this, it may have been book one or two, but they had a scan using Oldfield's technology, PIP technology, of a guy who was reporting these symptoms of being choked and he was coughing and he was hearing voices and he was talking to someone who wasn't there. They scanned him and on the readout on the field, you could see in his field there was a snake-like shadowy object that was wrapped around him and causing him to, it was actually constricting around his throat and was causing the sensations of being choked and this kind of stuff.
But if we didn't have the technology, they would have said, oh, he's crazy. He's crazy. He's schizophrenic. He's insane. He's lost his marbles. He's talking to someone who's not there. But now we can say, oh, well, actually, there is something there. It's just outside of the realm of our normal frequency perception. And if you can get a competent psychic or seer to check it out, they'll be able to verify what the machine is showing you as well. So there's massive, massive, massive, just endless overlaps between the occult and the world of science and technology now that a lot of people just aren't aware of. I really got right into that in book one and book two as well.
[1:04:12] Entity Attachment and Discernment
Judith: What you just mentioned reminds me a little bit of entity attachment. And I know there are quite a number of people out there that remove it for you. What would be... I think that's a good idea to discern, because personally I always have this thought: how do I know that I do not end up with more entities after he or she has worked on me? You know what I mean? Because that can happen as well. That they actually do not remove anything but put more stuff into you.
Brendan: Yeah. Yeah. What was your question?
Judith: How would you discern that? Where to go, whom to trust. I find that is a very touchy subject.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah, I think that a lot of people have opinions about it. And it's in the realm of religion, we're touching on religious ideas that are very old. And a lot of people have very set, narrow ways of thinking about this.
It seems to me that it's just a matter of, you've got to do your homework. There's so many different people and modalities out there now that you have to investigate them, and it's good if you know someone who's personally been through it and used a certain method or practitioner. And you can get their personal feedback on it and the results. It's all about the results, right? How's their life changed? How are they feeling now after the session? How's their health? Are their symptoms better or worse? You really have to dig past the sales page of a website or whatever to get to the meat of it.
And what I like about the sound work that I do is that it creates a very, very fundamental energetic kind of structural change in people at a foundational level so that entity attachment actually becomes a more difficult proposition. It's harder for entities to become attached and also to stay attached because the energy structure, the energetic field, is no longer as vulnerable. There's certain, and then I think that's a great idea of transforming yourself from the inside out. Again, this is the kind of work that I do.
So I like that idea of almost making yourself bulletproof in a way. We're not totally impervious, but then again, maybe we can be. It depends on beliefs. Our whole reality runs on belief systems, right? If you think that you're open to entities, if you're worried about entities and you're constantly thinking about entities, you're probably going to attract entities.
Judith: Yeah, that is right. Yeah. And some people... Sorry, go ahead.
Brendan: No, go ahead.
Judith: I was just going to say some people get rid of them and then they feel really weird because they've had them for so long and they get upset. And they call them back.
Brendan: So personal development and personal work is an important thing. You want to build yourself up and develop yourself to the point where you can be alone with yourself and function okay, because some people aren't okay with that. They can't do it. They can't be alone with their own thoughts. They get so addicted to the entity's thoughts that they don't know where the line is between them and the entity, and the entity goes and they're like, oh my god, who am I now? This is just not comfortable.
Judith: Yeah. Or they need a constant distraction. A phone, a book, if it even is a book.
Brendan: Yeah, yeah.
Judith: Something must be going on, something where I can fiddle around. And that is also a good... when I went to hospital, I didn't have, first of all, I don't even have a cell phone, but I didn't take a book, anything. I was just with myself. I wanted to know, can I do this? It was comfortable, it was okay, no problem, and then no TV.
Brendan: Yeah. Yeah, wow. That's like going back to the Stone Age.
Judith: Yeah, but that's absolutely correct. If you are very worried about entities all the time, you will attract them.
Brendan: Yeah, it's a funny thing, you can sort of go too far one way or too far the other way. If you're walking around in your ego and you're telling yourself things like, oh, I'm the most powerful being, I'm the most powerful, biggest, baddest dude there is, then another entity that picks up on that might feel like a challenge and might take that as a challenge and as an invitation to come and inhabit your energy field and manipulate you and harvest your energy. I mean, it's a very strange thing.
So there's confidence and there's overconfidence. It's sort of like you don't want to be in fear, but you also don't want to be arrogant and inviting challenges from whatever's floating around out there because your thoughts are broadcast. So they get picked up by God knows what. It's sort of like you kind of walk the middle way and you just be confident within yourself and know who and what you are without the additional kind of macho, I'm the king. No, nothing can touch me kind of thing. Tough dog. You don't need to be Sylvester Stallone.
[1:10:31] Schizophrenia and Entities
Judith: Yeah. What you said reminded me of Jerry Musinski. I had him on. He's a mental health counselor. He worked for many decades in that field. And he came to the conclusion that schizophrenics are actually attacked by entities. That it has nothing to do with the chemical imbalance in the brain. That those voices, because he said when you listen to them, it's coherent. It is as if you are listening to only one side of a telephone conversation. Because if it were just hallucinations, that would be all over the place. But because it is coherent, after many years he came to the conclusion that something totally different is going on.
And so he reported that one gentleman got rid of his voices, he was successful, and then he actually called them back because he felt lonely.
Yeah, that's what I was saying. Yeah. Yeah. Yep, absolutely. Absolutely. Misery likes company.
Brendan: Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah. Exactly right. You'll call in the company that matches your vibration. So be careful what you are calling in.
Judith: I reached the same conclusion. I agree totally.
Brendan: And it's interesting that in the realm of afterlife research, for example, Instrumental Transcommunication and the predecessor to that, where they were recording voices on tape, EVP, electronic voice phenomena, those disembodied voices were picked up. That's been done around the world by thousands and thousands of people, and frequently there are coherent sentences that come through from God knows where, but there's an intelligence there. It's obviously intelligent. So if we can measure that, and if that's actually being recorded on electronic devices, then is it really so far-fetched to say, well, maybe whatever is giving us this message might actually be hanging around and interfering with us? It's not a big leap.
Judith: No, no, no, it is not.
[1:13:08] Where Things Are Heading
Judith: So to wrap this up, we have a lot of crazy stuff going on right now. And at the same time, we have a minority that is going faster and faster and developing other things, interested in other things. We have these parallels going on. And yes, we are a minority, I know, and it probably will stay that way. Where do you see things going in the bigger picture? Because it feels to me like it's going fast on both sides, trying to outpace each other, and the bones that they are throwing at you, another distraction here, you can panic here and look here, you will be exterminated in the next couple of months. Where do you see it going?
Brendan: Well, it depends on your time frame, I think. How far into the future are you looking?
Judith: Let's say the next five years.
Brendan: Oh, okay, yeah. Oh, man. I think we'll see increasing indications that we are...
Judith: Winning the battle, winning the war?
Brendan: I do. I think that there will be a commensurate response to that from the psychopaths as they try to hang on to whatever's left. It's interesting because so much of humanity now is experiencing this collective awakening of conscience and care. And at the same time, the elite are hijacking that and directing it into very unhelpful, counterproductive neo-religions, like global warming's gonna end the world, and all this sort of stuff that they do.
It's interesting because humans wake up a bit and then they get hijacked a bit, and then the control system responds and comes back with another punch. I think that's going to get more and more accentuated, and I think what's happening is we're going to see more and more indications of how obvious and transparent the manipulation actually is, and that's going to make it easier and easier for people who are ready to actually wake up and come to the light, so to speak. And I think in the next five years, it's going to be really interesting, possibly very intense. We might get some interesting earth changes, hopefully not too severe.
But it's interesting if you look back at the near-death realm of research documented by people like Kenneth Ring, they were talking about a lot of their people, near-death experiences, were having very powerful visions of the future, and a lot of them thought that there was going to be massive catastrophe in 1988, for example, and that never quite happened. We keep anticipating the worst, but it never quite eventuates. We always expect the end of the world, but we always manage to dodge it somehow. We figure out a way around it.
And you have people saying, oh, we're on a positive timeline now and all this kind of stuff. I think they're tapping into the momentum and the collective, the attitude shift and the change in our openness and our concern and care for each other and for the environment now. And you can see with what's happening in France and all the protests, people are uniting and banding together. Not always in very constructive ways. We're still very susceptible to being manipulated and lied to, and you can see that in ways we've already mentioned. But yeah, the next five years are going to be fun. I think very, very interesting. Never a dull moment. So the challenge is always going to be to stay centred and to operate from our centre, and respond instead of reacting.
[1:17:25] Closing Thanks and Early Starts
Judith: Yeah. Yeah. Wonderfully said. Thank you so much for coming. I had a lot of fun.
Brendan: Pleasure.
Judith: Me too.
Brendan: Thank you, Judith. I've enjoyed it thoroughly.
Judith: Yeah. And I hope you will come back.
Brendan: For sure. For sure.
Judith: And I will let you go now.
Brendan: Oh, thank you. I will start my day.
Judith: You will finish the [?].
Brendan: Thank you. I appreciate you starting early for me.
Judith: Yeah, I don't think I would have been able to do eight o'clock.
Brendan: Yeah, many, many times when I was in the workforce, I had to start at five o'clock in the morning.
Judith: Wow. I've heard of it.
Brendan: And so, yeah, getting up at 3 a.m. was nothing strange to me.
Judith: Wow. Wow, you're tougher than I am. Because I need time to get ready. I need to take my shower, do my hair, get dressed, have a cup of coffee or whatever. And I need time. I cannot just jump out and then burn through it.
Brendan: And then race to the airport and here I am. Yeah, yeah.
Judith: I am. So, okay guys, this was it, Nightflight for today with the wonderful Brendan D. Murphy, and we see you all next time. Stay safe and sound.